Dog training makes a lot more difference than breeding to a dog's behaviour.
It always makes me facepalm when people (usually cocky and uneducated idiots) so confidently claim that Pits are born to attack animals/eat babies/mug pensioners/commit white-collar crime or whatever else they think they do.
I know the general public are fools to the media, but HOW can people be so mislead when educated dog owners tell them that Pits are perfectly safe and that bad dogs come from bad dog owners?
Abused Dog Training - How to Train an Abused Dog
Recommended Answer:
i am quite sure you are the uneducated one here ... pit bulls are not just like any other dog ... have you ever heard of dog on dog aggression as a known and accepted behaviour trait ... and how offensive you use jack russells in the same question as pit bulls ... in the last 25 YEARS there have been two deaths resulting from jack russell terriers, one was a women who was recovering from surgery and a jack bit her lip which became infected and she died ... even if you kick or attack my jack russell she is not going to latch on and kill or main you, a pit bull might ... and the most ignorant thing you said is they are being bred to be more friendly ... frick that is funny and so clueless ... the dogs have been ruined due to poor breeding making them even more unstable and unpredictable ... grab a clue, this question makes you look so ignorant on the subject ..
Secrets of Dog Training Professionals - Why Use Food?
- Why people think pit bulls are mean because of the news saying there mean dogs and head lines like pit bull go lose attacking dog to children and say they should be baned. That's why people don't like pit bulls and i am always telling people there nice dogs forget the news, resource like website and more. I am out to tell people that Rottweilers and Dover mans And pit bulls are nice dog and just the same.
- Yes, people are completely stupid for not seeing that it's not the Pits that are the problem - it's the clueless and cruel owners who are the problem (barring some weird, genetic and/or neurological problem on the part of the Pit, that is)....
I guess the only way people can hope to reverse this incorrect mind-set is to ensure that they get out there as much as possible with their Pits, showing others what great dogs they are (which is a tactic that another poster has already confirmed works...). - First of all- I do not agree with everything you say. Genetically screwed dogs do happen...yes even with "pitbulls" ...despite training.
Soooo...in my honest opinion, here is what needs to happen but likely never will.....EVERYONE who owns a dog, no matter what breed, size, or temperament....need to be RESPONSIBLE & have CONTROL over their dog/s.
If someone has a dog that is not sound...& far from....they should have CONTROL.....not let it run a muck killing children & other animals & not leaving their newborns with dogs...last time I checked, dogs do not make reliable babysitters. - People need to stop messing with genetics....pits are MEANT to be animal aggressive, they were bred to do a specific job, nothing wrong with it...and breeders dont need to mess with that, in my opinion. And NO, that job wasnt dog fighting...if that's where you are going with this.Genetics is more important than training..not the other way around. If your dog is bred correctly and can be animal aggressive...nothing wrong with that. Keep him away from situations that could cause problems....
Its the same as breeding German Shepherds without the herding ability/drive...what the hell are you going to get??? - I love pits. Your question is naive. Look around you. You don't see Michael Vick breeding Dachshunds for fighting, do you? Nor do I see guys dragging around Cocker Spaniels with huge chains on their necks to build muscle; or see well-meaning but totally uninformed idiots writing in about their 'blue nose' and 'red nose' poodles.
- Small-minded people's prejudices aren't limited to humans. They judge dogs by breed instead of training/ temperament, just like they judge people on race/ethnicity/religion. I've lived with pit bulls my whole life, and the only dog that ever bit me was an 18 lb. Shnauzer mix.
- Actually, all dogs are NOT created equal. Look at the research. certain dogs are more likely to be aggressive. Period. I'm sure there are plenty of nice pits, but I'm not risking my kids, my money, nor my lifestyle when I get sued over them biting someone.
- No dog is the same, one breed is not like any other breed. But pits are great dogs. I've always dreamed of owning one. Badly trained pits (for fighting) will attack, but that is because they have been abused by people and the other dogs.
- i have a pitt dull and they are one of the nicest most friendliest dog u will ever meet:)
- every dog is not the same
- i agree with you any dog that's not trained will be bad it's just this is my idea don't take it the wrong way that a lot of teenage lads like to use these dogs like a weapon look how hard I am and it these people that are giving the breed a bad name if i had a penny for every time that a media ran a bad pittbull story and the owner was a 17-19 year old lad thug in most cases i be rich it is the owners they don't care about the training most of these boys are using there dog like a status in there gang there friends has one so they get one and the people to arrange dog fights are to blame cruel and it's rising staffs pits and other dogs in these breeds are getting a bad name because of young stupid lads with egos and the cruel sport of dog fighting say what you like they are large number of young lads way these types of dogs go to liverpool n.ireland glasgow i seen it with my own eyes and they care more about there egos than there dogs i saw one lad to could not even control his on the lead then would not even clean up after it in the park he should never been aloowed out with it
- Well answer me this - are people really stupid enough to not understand that pit bulls were BRED to be ANIMAL AGGRESSIVE? It has nothing to do with their "abused ancestors" for god's sake. It's called genetics - you can't change that.
The weird pit bulls are the ones that don't have an AA gene in their body - they are the weak link in the genetic gene pool (like cowardly Dobermans).
Does this mean they have to be used in dog fighting? Absolutely not.
Does it mean they are more likely to attack a human? No, as long as the person owning them knows how to raise and handle them properly (but this goes for MANY dog breeds).
Are they any less likely to be a good pet? Of course not.
But it is foolish to sit there and think that a pit bull will never one day go after another animal/dog.
ADD: You're not understanding.
People aren't breeding pit bulls to lose the AA in them - where did you come up with that? People are not breeding the AA in them to be in dog fights or people killers either.
You can't really "breed out" characteristics of a breed that were "bred in" to make the breed what it is today.
People need to understand the breed they own and train accordingly. Want to use the JRT as an example? Fine. If you haven't trained that dog to focus 100% on you and perfect your recall (and you trained it this way knowing this breed has been bred with a high prey drive) - good luck getting the thing to listen to you when some rat goes running across the field... - pitt bulls are amazing dogs and no not always mean. my mom had a pitt for me and my sister when were younger and he was sweetest dog ever. very protective never growled or bark unless a certain someone showed up at our house. u can take any breed of dog and it can attack. its in a dogs instinct to attack if it feels threatened. but there are idiots that train their dogs to fight and its usually pitts cuz of their size and stamina. u can take a toy poodle and it can be ferocious like a pitt. but people hear what they do on tv and radio and form their own opinions without knowing all the facts. just cuz one dog attacks another dog or a child doesnt mean they all do
- Good grief. What planet do you live on? Pit Bulls are just like any other dog? I'll be damned if that statement hold any merit whatsoever.
Aggression has been bred OUT? Say you? Where the sam hill did you get that? It is the *aggression* (ie: dog/animal aggression) which you are referring to?
I am really in a complete funk how you think a genetic trait that has been bred for centuries has all of the sudden been bred out. When did that happen? Last year? Oh, maybe a bit later.....2 years?
Here is where I become very irate because you are *bunny hugging* *sugar coating* a powerful breed which with skewed genetics coupled with bad training and negative environment creates a MONSTER. We have MORE of these than ever because every body and his cousin in breeding these dogs in their back yards giving absolutely no consideration of what kind of temperament/genetics they are creating. We end up with horribly dangerous dogs because of this.
It is right in you FACE. Is your face in the mud?
A properly bred American Pit Bull Terrier is a dog with superior prey drive, the ability to fight and kill. They are Gladiators. Warriors. It is up to the owner to teach and contain this drive until it is needed to manifest itself.
A SOUND APBT is NOT ever human aggressive. A genetically hard nerved APBT will never lay teeth on a human.
What we have in society today is NOT the real APBT but a poorly bred dog with the skewed brain which causes it to *come undone* attacking all other creatures and seriously maiming and/or killing.
The human included.
So while you are spreading honey, I will be right behind you dumping dirt on your ignorant statement.
Truly? Please tell *Pits are like any other dog* to the woman who had known her Pit was NOT right, had seen the *signs* of a skewed brain, was considering euthanizing but did not do it fast enough. The dog literally removed her arm from her body.
Now, you tell me how many other *breeds* are capable of this? You are not owning a dog who will bite you, take some flesh and walk away. You are dealing with a dog that will grab/hold and has the power and drive to keep going until they kill. You can't pull them off. You can break a brick over their heads. They are oblivious to pain when in this mode. The can be a killing machine.
So stop this crap. Causing people out there who have not a clue in hell what they may be bringing home.
Edit: I just realized I have you blocked. Must be for a good reason. - If you have never even seen one then how do you know what APBTs are like or even how they are supposed to be?
1. No they aren't like every other dog. IF they were like every other job they would be a good fit for anyone and everyone and they are NOT. Like most prey driven dogs they are for people who actually understand what they are getting into and know how to handle their dog's triggers
2. How do you know what people are breeding for? GOOD breeders are not breeding soft APBTs, while not all are going for a true game bred dog they ARE however still breeding dogs that are or can be dog aggressive at times. That is the nature of this breed.
3. " Dogs aren't needed to attack animals so nobody should be breeding animal-aggressive dogs. " Hmm tell that to anyone who hunts feral hogs and needs a good catch dog. Dog fighting may be illegal in most areas, but the APBTs drive is applicable in other areas.
4. Since you don't own one, never have, and have no real life experience with one what makes you think you are better suited than ANYONE on here who does have the above to tell people how the breed is?
There is a big difference between any based aggression and human based. The first is a breed trait and why the breed was created. The second is NOT an accepted breed trait and any dog displaying such should be put down. - Wow i live in the UK and am astounded by your question and Inaccurate facts My answer is when you understand about the APBT come back and ask a question not a rant
- "Are people really stupid enough to not understand that Pit Bulls are just like any other dog?"
-------- APBT are NOT just like any other dog- which is why they need a much more responsible owner, who can understand the breed tendencies, their unique drives, and how to properly contain these dogs- AND basic precautions, like not bringing them to dog parks, etc.
"Especially the Pits these days, who have been bred to be more dog-friendly than their abused ancestors."
--------- a properly bred APBT will exhibit the same drives and physical traits as their game bred ancestors. if you want a dog that LOOKS the same, but does not contain the drive, you should be referencing AmStaffs, who have been bred for nearly 100 years for the looks, but not the drives.
"Dog training makes a lot more difference than breeding to a dog's behaviour."
--------- that's great. i'll let the folks who spend their lives embroiled in genetics that they're wasting their time. that statement points to the fact that you aren't a breeder, haven't studied genetics (even a little, outside 10th grade biology!) and have NO idea about temperamental traits being genetic, just as physical traits are!
"It always makes me facepalm when people (usually cocky and uneducated idiots) so confidently claim that Pits are born to attack animals/eat babies/mug pensioners/commit white-collar crime or whatever else they think they do. "
---------- saying that APBT's and bully breeds are born to eat people is nonsense. dogmen always culled man-biters- they needed a dog they could handle in the pit, and one they could trust around their children. APBT's WERE bred to battle with other dogs, AND to catch and kill vermin and small animals, so yes, they ARE bred to attack animals. and any well bred APBT will still have a very strong prey drive towards other animals, just as a PRT wants badly to dig up the yard in search of moles, and when it finds them, it will chase and kill them!
"I know the general public are fools to the media, but HOW can people be so mislead when educated dog owners tell them that Pits are perfectly safe and that bad dogs come from bad dog owners?"
--------APBT's are NOT perfectly safe- too many idiots bring them to dog parks and then get bitten breaking up fights.
--------BAD dogs do NOT come from bad owners- they come from BAD breeders- a temperamentally sound dog is a temperamentally sound dog. it is BORN like that. an unstable dog will be unstable from the time it is born. maybe it can be managed, and maybe not. it's not a reasonable chance to take, in any case.--------you are DEAD wrong if you believe that the dog-aggression or animal-aggression has been bred out of APBT's- a well bred APBT has just as strong a prey drive as his ancestors 100 years ago.
------- you ARE CORRECT that APBT who have a strong prey drive should be properly managed. BUT- it should be assumed that EVERY APBT has a strong prey drive, because often, they won't show any sign of it until something triggers it, and by then, it's too late for the owner to react. the adage "he's never done THAT before!" is no longer a viable excuse- because of ALL the APBT owners who are warning people beforehand!
--------- if you've never even seen one, don't make assumptions like "it's all in how you raise them" or "bad owners make bad dogs"
come to the USA and meet some first- you can talk to some dogmen, meet some of the actual dogs, and understand their drives, genetic temperament, and proper handling. - I love APBTs. They are amazing dogs. Tons of energy (good for hiking), super friendly with people, lots of prey drive (yay for training!), usualy smart but stubborn (yeah, I like a challenge)!
But I am not deluded. I've only attended two dog shows (specifically geared towards APBTs) and have been working in a 80% 'pit bull' mix shelter for 3 years and it has ben enough for me to learn that MOST have issues with other dogs/cats. So what? They are not the only breed to have those issues (Akitas and Jack Russels come to mind) and judging by the dogs I've seen at shows and the responsible breeders I've talked to, ANIMAL/DOG AGGRESSION IS NOT BEING BRED OUT. It's a breed trait and not something to be ashamed of, but it does mean that they are not the right choice for all dog owners. Every breed has its own tendencies, and this is one of the APBTs. If you are keeping your dog properly contained, it shouldn't be an issue.
P.S. Some people still use their dogs to hunt in which case the high prey drive/animal aggression is very useful.
ADD: Animal aggression and human aggression are two very different things.
Are you scared that a Greyhound will turn on you because it kills a rabbit? Sounds foollish right?
Are you scared of an APBT because it kills another dog? Well, that's just as foollish as the last statement.
What we do have to fear is the back yard breeder. Any breed that becomes popular, as the APBT has become, faces this challenge. Back yard breeders produce dogs that are not up to par tempermentally and unfortunately the APBT is plagued with these 'breeders' that do not care or do not know how to asess proper temperament. They are the ones producing the majority of the unstable dogs that bite humans. Those dogs need to be killed but they are produced in every breed that becomes popular and are often bred producing even more unstable dogs. Since the ban has been inacted in Denver, LABRADOR RETRIEVERS lead in number of dog bites. When you are looking for a GSD, you will always be cautioned about severe shyness/aggression due to poor breeding practices by some people. APBTs are not the only ones that have been subjected to this. - Rants aren't allowed here, you know.
Guess what Miss Know-It-All. These particular dogs WERE INDEED bred for attacking other animals. Why in the world is the name "pit" in their name? Because they were bred to attack other animals - bulls, boar, bear, etc. - in "sporting" fights, and then when those were outlawed, they went underground and fought dog against dog!
You need to do some more research.
The reason anything resembling a "pit bull" is ostracized is PRECISELY because people don't know how to handle them. If you have a sensible owner who understands its dogs drive and history, then it can be managed. Put a bully breed dog in the hands of a neophyte or someone who thinks, "Awwww, Mr. Pit Bull is a big cuddly sweetie teddy bear, he wouldn't hurt a fly!" - you're going to end up in tears and with a lawsuit because Mr. Pit Bull is instigating fights, not taking sh*t from other dogs, and nearly killed a handful in his few short years here.
The American pit bull terrier is a great dog. Great dog with an interesting history and a tremendous tenacity and nobility. But it's NOT for any old fool to own or handle.
Also, your statement of "aggression is bred OUT of Pits these days" - says whom? GOOD breeders of the APBT are continuing to breed lovely, typey dogs with lots of drive - bombproof dogs, that's great. It's not just AGGRESSION - it's DRIVE, a desire to hunt and kill prey and molded.
The other 80% or so of "pit bulls" out there are Backyard Breeder junk - genetically unstable, fear-aggressive, ENCOURAGED to snarl and hackle at anything on 2 or 4 legs. There are far more unstable "pits" out there than well-bred, malleable ones.
Interesting that you can know so much about a breed, when you've "never even seen one." What are you, God? - Pits are NOT just like other dogs, they are bred for animal aggression. That has not been bred out of them.
I know two people personally that have their animals killed by Loose Pits. One was a lovely Miniature horse mare that was a trained Therapy Animal, and part of our Therapy group. She was torn open by a pit that ran into her corral and attacked her.
Then a friend that had a Greyhound had her dog attacked and killed by two pits that were let loose by an irresponsible dog sitter - when she was walking by with her dog on a leash, on a public sidewalk. She also got bit herself in the scuffle by the two pits as she was trying to defend her gentle greyhound.
I also would like to add that I work in an insurance office and have also had a claim against one of our clients when their pit killed the next door neighbors dog when their pit got off of its chain. So I actually know two people who have had their animals killed by a pit, and one person who owned a pit (it was euthanized after it killed the neighbors dog) that killed another dog.
This is not behavior of most "normal" dogs .... they don't go around killing other dogs and animals larger than they are.
You have your head in the sand if you don't think that these events happen with this breed of dog. - Dear Inquirer,
Look at it this way from the public's point of view.
1. Children are brought up better today than than our ancestries did. We have better knowledge on how to teach them (train).
2. Children are as safe as any other children out there and get into trouble too. (They must have come from bad parents, no matter how defiant the child was).
3. Most kids are cute and cuddly too as the grow up and they have lot's of drives too that push them forward in life. But which kids are more controlable? The kids that are quiet and peaceful to others? Or the ones that lifts weights and trained to fight for protection purposes. More physically demanding on the parents part when it comes to controlling that child when in public or on its' own.
4. Most parent try their best and give them love and effection. But as soon as the child does something wrong, the public stereotypes the child regardless of how the child was truly brought up! Even thou the child came from a good home and was cared for and well fed, the public categorizes that child as one that " must've had a bad upbringing or the parents didn't care enough for the child. When in fact the child has defiance and curiousity in their lives which then tells them that they shouldn't be doing this without being cautious in what they are doing. This is right from wrong thinking. Something that dogs understand, because theyARE trained from right and wrong because we punish the dog when it messes on the floor! We reward thee dog with treats when the dog obeys our command and has learned to roll over!
The problem is when the dog doesn't have the physical strength to hold back the dog when the dog feels something is getting to close to their owners (parents) and they immediately react to a situation, like another dog walking by showing off its' aggressiveness saying to the other dog, "I'm pumped up and ready to fight you if you don't let my bad self through" attitude because that's how that dog was raised. And when your dog responds without the owner (parents) being there posed and ready to respond at alls times, that dog (child) stills ends up KILLING someone else just like any other child (dog) would.
But wait! What happened to all the good owners (parents)? How come people categorize them as murderers in the paper and on the news? Why don't they look upon them as JUST another child (dog) that hasn't gotten enough attention in the news as well?
Because it's more dangerous to the public when it comes to bad things being reported than good things. Nobody ever says, "Hey those children haven't killed anybody so far this year and we wanted to report this in the news so everyone.
So hope this gives everyone a better understanding about public perspective on dogs. - This entire question/rant is a HOT STIR-FRIED MESS and is complete HOGWASH. BOLOGNA.
If you've never seen one, how the hell are you going to know what they are even like ?
"My point is that aggression is bred OUT of Pits these days"
What pills were you popping when you wrote out this complete mess ? Are you telling me there are no badly bred, unstable APBT's out there ??! Seriously, get your head out of the sand.
"Dog training makes a lot more difference than breeding to a dog's behaviour."
No, it doesn't. Breeding/Genetics triumph any training/raising!!!!
The fact still remains is that the breed was purposely bred to BE DA and AA. The breed standard even CALLS for it !!! There is no need to breed it out. If you don't want a dog with those traits, find another breed. Human aggression is NOT and SHOULD NOT be tolerated at any costs.
They are NOT like "any other breed".. It takes a responsible, realistic, well educated, capable person to own a breed like this. We don't need anymore "sugar coaters"!!
I would go into this ALOT more, but if I did I would have either a heart attack or a stroke. - Considering it takes decades or more to actually breed drive and temperament into a dog, and that's by people who actually know what they're doing, to say that it can simply be bred out by nations of morons randomly breeding their pets is more than just a leap. Most people have never seen an actual APBT or Staffie, and when you know nothing about the breed (or in the case of the random 'pit bull', a mix of bully breeds), I'm not sure how you become an expert in the proper drive, or witness to the fact that it has been officially bred out by virtue of the fact that the drive is no longer needed
- pit bulls are only good for one thing that's killing smaller dogs, grandparents and children. only good pit is a euthanized pit
- I honestly believed this, that pit bulls were evil creatures who couldn't be taught any better, and killed anything in sight. But then my friend showed me his pit bulls and they are the most loving dogs there are. I think that the reason so many people fear these dogs are the media's hyped up allegations toward pit bulls, just for their ratings! Yes, pit bulls can be trained to attack, just like german shephards. Yes, they can kill someone because they are stronger, but should we just lock up everything that could kill us? They have become a key partner in many people's lives, and we should respect them, along with loving them.