Dog Health Questions: Does anyone know about Schutzhund dog training??

We have a doberman puppy that is 14 weeks old, and we have recently started training him for Schutzhund. He is doing really well with the bite rag, and doing everything he should with that. My problem is that he doesn't want to focus on me when we are doing his obedience work. He only wants to focus on his treat, not look at me, which is what he is supposed to do. I was reading an article about getting them to focus, and i tried it, which was they said to have a treat, and hold it away from you, and get your dog to look at you then give it the treat. I tried that, and all my pup would do is look at the treat for ever, then get bored, and loose interest. So i need some more ideas how to get this to work. He is a very smart puppy, he already knows sit, and down, but he gets confused sometimes. Does this mean he just doesn't really know what he is doing?? How can we fix this also? How long do you wait before you start to teach him a new trick after he has leaned the first one?

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Don't push the obedience - make it fun for him or it will show up in the protection phase - be sure and get him into tracking as well but again, all should be very enjoyable. He doesn't 'know' sit or anything, he is simply offering behavior in hopes it will get him a treat - instead of trying to get him to focus on you in a static situation, sit or whatever, just have him moving round aimlessly on a line with you moving as well and the SECOND he makes eye contact, mark it and treat him. The MARK is the indication of what he is doing correctly and the treat or toy is simply a reward that is always given after the mark. So if he glances at you for a split second, you make the mark sound, whatever you choose but it is ALWAYS the mark and it always means he will get a treat/toy/reward. As his glancing at you lengthens out you will see him click - at 14 weeks, he knows nothing so don't even believe that - just get him to pay attention to you and ALL things good come through you. His dinner comes after a glance and a mark - going outside to play comes after a glance and a mark. Eventually he will be paying attention and you can start on the static exercises. If you can find a Michael Ellis seminar, he is GREAT with puppy training! WELL worth the money!

Add: Curtis M obviously has never trained a dog in schutzhund - you do NOT have 'rock solid obedience' prior to bite work -- please find a good schutzhund trainer. Michael Ellis does primarily FR but he has done schutzhund and his training of puppies is exceptional. The obedience is easy, it will come and if you brow beat a puppy into it now, all phases will suffer. The 'treat' isn't the key -- timing, marking and reward is the key -- shoveling food into the puppy just gives him the runs - make it work for you and the dog by rewarding wisely or you will regret it. Hot dogs are fine but some puppy's food desire can be over the top and they won't learn anything - mark the behavior and reward with something that is worthwhile and good but not overwhelming or full of crap like hot dogs - they can work fine but there are better rewards and more diverse ones as well. One reward that my b*tch loved after a good obedience workout was a release to jump on a table - she loved to be on a table and show off - she loved food but when she did really good she got marked, released and sent to the table! You have to know what your dog really enjoys and while my girl was a food hound, she preferred the table for really good times. Find a good trainer and see about some decent seminars to help you. It is a PUPPY - don't push it - enjoy it.

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• you should try leerburg.com, he has been working with schutzhund dogs for over 45 years and knows everything about it, it sounds like he needs to build drive and focus, try bernhard flinks, he will help you with it, (leerburg will probably reccomend a video, they are expensive but VERY usefull, if you have to, buy building drive and focus)


• we use to spit hotdogs at the dog... when they look at you can focus on your face..they get a hotdog! There are some great books but I prefer Schutzhund Obedience TRaining in Drive by Gottfried Dildei...can be a bore to read but very very good!!


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• I used to train in Schutzhund, the best thing to do would be to find a Schutzhund club in your area to train with. We used to make sure the dog had rock solid obedience training before starting ANY man work, and we started youngsters doing tracking first also. To get your pup to look at you put the treat in your mouth! Just sticking out where he can see it.
  This also establishes you as pack leader, adult canines regurgitate food for youngsters, food from your mouth = leader to dogs.
  Too lazy to do it for you, but, google the American Schutzhund association, they should have a list of regional clubs and lots of info.


• All you need to worry about right now is the biting...play biting. Teaching him to bite full....rewarding with the tug when he barks...letting him win when he "counters" with a full bite.
  Spitting hotdogs is fine....keep them under your hat. You'll see ALOT of top competitors "straighten" their hat before each exercise (to get the dog excited ab bout getting a treat). Cheating??....well, yes....kinda...but they get away with it. As far as tracking....you could go do "treat" tracks right now if you're completely bored. If I were doing S&R...I'd be doing nothing but tracking at this age. Schutzhund tracking is completely different. You're better off to wait until he's an adult and train it similar to an obedience routine. Forced tracking will always out-score the bait trackers.
  Very limited obedience right now. Make it all indusive. No major corrections until his biting is full & confident.


• The first answer was the only one worth reading...You don't want a rock solid obedience puppy before you start bitework. To get rock solid obedience you must correct. When you overly correct a pup you destroy drive dead drive = ineffective Schutzhund dog. Everything should be prey drive and play time at this age. I used to use the hotdog trick myself, but then I switched to a training vest, with a high pocket for treats which makes them look up at you. Some people just hold their hand up high near their shoulder. A good video for you is Drive, Focus, and Grip by Bernhard Flinks. As for the "time elapse" for teaching a new "trick". I teach in order, come, sit, down, stay. Then I start working on the more complicated actions. I HIGHLY recommend you start going to your local Schutzhund club with your puppy, other trainers/handlers would be willing to help you.
  
  -edit- And he's right about the bite rag, that's the most important thing right now, to build his prey drive, that video I recommended will help you send his prey drive skyrocketing. Once the dog "gets" bitework is when you truly start training for rock solid obedience. You can begin tracking now. I take a few steps and let the puppy watch me while tied out and drop a few pieces of liver biscotti treat in every other track or so. He'll get the idea. Use less and less treats. Use the articles when he's ready.
  
  Nancy maybe you didn't read correctly I said "You DON'T want a rock solid obedience puppy before starting bitework" having rock solid obedience means a LOT of corrections, a LOT of corrections = Diminished drive.


• we use to spit hotdogs at the dog... when they look at you can focus on your face..they get a hotdog! There are some great books but I prefer Schutzhund Obedience TRaining in Drive by Gottfried Dildei...can be a bore to read but very very good!!